In light of the fact that in my mind science fiction and fantasy are complete opposite genres, I thought I’d take some time to explore this valid question. I had this discussion with a few people online a while back and I have included part of the debate below.
*A bit lengthy, but an interesting debate.
Person 1:
Star Wars is not Science Fiction, it is Space Fantasy, there is a difference.
Me:
Here is a little info I was able to come up with:
From http://www.kheper.net/topics/scifi/grading.html
"Star Wars is considered "Space Fantasy" by its creator, but sci fi by others."
"The original Star Wars might be considered Very Soft Sci Fi, although George Lucas specifically defines it as "Space Fantasy", rather than "Science Fiction.”
"SCIENCE FANTASY: claims to be Science Fiction but also includes one or more supernaturalist elements that remove it from the realm of pure Science Fiction. Star Wars can more properly be included with other Soft Sci Fi popular universes. The only "fantasy" element in SW is The Force, and even this is explained in technobabble terms (midichlorians") in the prequel trilogy."
Science fantasy is a subclass of science fiction sometimes with some fantasy elements thrown in, resulting in a blending of the two popular genres of writing
Seems to me that "Space Fantasy" was a term that Lucas came up with himself. Most websites that I could come up with considered SW to be bascially a Sci-fi. Others went as far as to say it was a Science Fantasy which according to wikipedia is a "subclass of science fiction."
So I guess in the end I was right. Star Wars = Science Fiction... with a few fantasy elements thrown in.
Person 1:
Other way around, it is a fantasy story that uses science fiction elements to help tell its story.
Me:
Well the evidence I presented indicates to the contrary. And there is much more where that came from. Do a google search for "Science Fiction Star Wars" and read through a few pages.
Most people classify SW as sci-fi, other's classify it as Science Fantasy which by definition is a "subclass of science fiction." I didn't make this stuff up bro, it's right out of the encyclopedia.
Person 1:
Personally, I don't care where it comes from. The complete plot of Star Wars relies on Fantasy elements, not science.
Person 2:
I'm with Dom on this one. It's very much a fantasy story, just set in a technologically advanced world. It's more fantasy than sci-fi, it's just not in the traditional dragons/wizards world. . .yet it does contain the classic fantasy elements (if the Force isn't magic, then I don't know what is!)
Me:
Believe me I see your point. I agree in every whit that the Force is a magical element and therefore a fantasy element (though they did try to sci-fi it a little with an explanation of midichlorienes - sorry about spelling). All I was saying is what I was able to find on line.
So I started thinking, if you did the entire 6 movies over but omitted the element of the force (I know it'd be nearly a different movie), then it would be a bunch of guys (knights in a way) wielding light sabers and flying around on hover cars and intergalactic star ships in a galaxy far far away. Which technically makes them aliens with advanced technology. Sounds fairly sci-fi-ish to me. Sci-fi with fantasy elements if you add back the force. But to me, the force is merely an alien ability.
Person 1:
That's a moot point, you can't take away the force from Star Wars without completely changing the film, even if you did, it would still be space fantasy.
In the end, you can see that I presented a lot of information that basically proved that SW is a sci-fi, but these people had closed eyes. My conclusion: SW = sci-fi. Having read the above conversation, what say you?
4 comments:
has a little of both elements, but my immediate response if someone were to ask would be science fiction. Take for example your book. There are aliens with special mind abilities, but you don't call it sci fantasy.
Personally, I don't think that "the force" is fantasy. I believe there are energies and powers that exist in our plane of living that we just don't know how to control or wield. I've seen miracles done with, what some people might consider, "the force." I don't hink you have to take "the force" out of Star Wars to make it a Science Fiction story...I think it adds to it's credibility!!
I'm going to go with the term Space Opera, which is a sub classification of Speculative Fiction, in many ways an amalgam of Science Fiction, and Fantasy.
The piece that the other people in the conversation didn't understand (and unfortunately you fell for the red herring) is that magic doesn't make Fantasy. I've read countless fantasy books that did not have magic, and I've also read non-fantasy books that DO have magic. Heck, if I'm not mistaken even some Dean Kuntz books people sometimes have special powers (certainly in Steven King), but that doesn't make them fantasy.
I think this wikipedia article explains what fantasy is quite well
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Themes_in_Fantasy
Essentially, when looking at the core elements of Sci-fi vs Fantasy, there is a lot of overlap. A few of the things that make fantasy unique are:
* Destiny (or Prophesy) - Boy who is destined to be the king
* Good vs Evil (not good vs bad) -- For example, the evil lich king who wants nothing more than the destroy all of humanity. Compare that to Harkonnen who wants to rule the galaxy.
* Alternate Reality with believable laws
By those three principles, Star Wars is KINDA a fantasy. Luke isn't really destined to be a Jedi, nor is he destined to destroy the Death Star, or overthrow the Emperor. The only first destiny wasn't seen until the Prequels when Anakin was foretold to bring balance tot he force.
Good vs Evil. Cut and Dry, Yoda/Luke vs Emperor.
Alternate Reality... I think A Long Time Ago in a galaxy far, far away sets that up pretty well.
Now take a look at a Space Opera. According to Wikipedia "Space opera is a subgenre of speculative fiction or science fiction that emphasizes romantic adventure, exotic settings, and larger-than-life characters."
Flash Gordon is a classic Space Opera, and that's where a lot of Star Wars found its roots. Space Operas favor the setting, action, and characters more than the science. They often ignore the laws of science to tell the story, and typically don't bother to explain the science of anything. You mentioned in your discussion, the midichlorians, and they really were the first time anything was scientifically explained.
Science fiction has its roots in science and technology. Dune for example practically spend a paragraph explaining how faster-than-light travel is actually possible.
So, in the end Star Wars (the original trilogy) is definitely Speculative Fiction, not Science-Fiction, has many similarities to Fantasy, but in the end is a Space Opera.
Aaron says:
I'm going to go with the term Space Opera, which is a sub classification of Speculative Fiction, in many ways an amalgam of Science Fiction, and Fantasy.
From Wikipedia on Space Opera (in the actual definition of the word at the very top): “Space opera is a subgenre of speculative fiction or science fiction that emphasizes romantic adventure, exotic settings, and larger-than-life characters.” (You also mentioned this in your post)
Yup, no mention of fantasy
Aaron Says:
If I'm not mistaken even some Dean Koontz books people sometimes have special powers (certainly in Steven King), but that doesn't make them fantasy.
I dunno, I just read one by Koontz in which a guy had the magical ability to animate matter… it was retarded. No explanation of how he got that power. I hated it. I would say that this WAS a fantasy element in his story.
Aaron Says:
Alternate Reality... I think A Long Time Ago in a galaxy far, far away sets that up pretty well.
Actually this is the very thing that makes it sci-fi for me. The phrase “far, far away” implies that it’s far away from what? Earth. Therefore, since Earth was brought into the story, the Star Wars technically takes place in our universe (not literally, but what I mean is it doesn’t take place on some fantasy existence).
Pretty much everything you said confirms my affirmation that SW is sci-fi. Basically my original argument was that SW is not fantasy. I agree it could be Space Opera of Space Fantasy… but both of those are classes of science-fiction by definition.
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